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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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 Posted: 10-Dec-2003 15:40 Post subject: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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I need ideas of what you would do with the following resources.
If your are the leader of a Periphery Government very much like the Tauran Concordat. You Have roughly equivalent Mech production capability, with 1 jumpship yard, and 2 aerospace/dropship yards. Your people have a similar level of education and poineering spirit of the Taurans. You have a total force of 45 RCTs of ground forces (15% elite,15%vetran,50%regular), 20 Space Defense forces(same experience). You have 25 "core/capitol" planets, 150 solid planets,
100 developing planets and about 50 skid row planets.
You are not currently at war with any power, and are not directly threatened by the clans. There is room for expansion into the deep periphery, and you enjoy the respect, if not friendship, of most major and minor powers. Your people do have a distaste for Comstar as it existed in the 4th sucession war era, and a hatred for WOB.
what are your posible choices for internal and external actions, why, and what would your priorities be?
_________________
Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side & a dark side, and strings also lie under it all.
Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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AWAD
Draconis Combine
Chu-sa
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 766
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| Posted: 10-Dec-2003 21:22 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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Whoa Neally, That is a Big one to Chew off.
Before I get going, seems to be too many planets.
1) Find my own communications system. Even if it means building a ton of little tiny jumpships that do nothing but carry pods full of electronic messages. Maybe not faster but not to much slower. More vulnerable to losing the message completely but safer communications and hard to interdict. This leads to point #2
2) Pirate points and exploration. In your own realm find a ton of pirate points around your planets so if there is an invasion you can get in our out in places other than the Nadir or Zenith. This means you ComPod Jumpships can get in out with some success. The explorations means finding new resource worlds, keeping the rugged individualist and expansionist personal of your people going, place to dump malcontents or honor and promote movers and shakers. One final luck it some old Star League ship that is loaded with New Tech Mechs and is abandoned..... O I digress to Munchkin Land. But maybe other people that fled and built a whole new society with their own technology. Trick is not to over expand and stretch resources.
3) Build alliances with other Periphery powers to make it difficult for a big power to knock any one off. If that does not work maybe some sort of non-aggression pact. Find one weaker major power that needs some desperate resource from you, even Mech units, and send them over for a ton of knowledge and ideas. Be careful of any strings and agents that may move in with this exchange. If a Periphery power is an impediment make a deal with the weaker large power to move in and destroy them.
4) Promote space warfare improvements. Make it where it hurts to come into your territory. Plus you can move assets quickly. This allows much force against weak spots or shores them up. Also special units have cover and move quickly. Next would be infantry. Do this either via Battle Armor or conventional infantry, or both. Just increase the weapons or protection or new tactical ideas with new equipment to support this. You are making very hard for anyone to consider occupation. That alone may make people not want to invade. To make this work, invade a few pirate planets. Gives your Space crews practice and infantry, plus a few supporting units experience to pass on to others. Mechs and Vehicles are the rocks and hammers of your defense but should be limited.
5) Determine some sort of commerical/civilian/scientfic application or common thought system and promote it. Make special universities and other incentives for people to pursue this. Like Bio Med; or Energy production; or even Entertainment. This allows keeping a happy populace and a place to expand knowledge with lesser government involvement. Also if you become a superior power in this you can trade or sell knowledge and ability to others for items you are weak in.
6) And maybe this should be first..... Establish a clear and mandatory line of succession with many variables thought of; be it monarchy, oligopoly, republic, communism, but stop the civil war, that will waste all the above items.
7) When the above is done...... Tell ComStar and WOB to get the hell off your planets and out of your space.
AWAD- This got me wanting to run my alternate world of Btech again
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 11-Dec-2003 13:22 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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That is a Big one to Chew off.
Before I get going, seems to be too many planets.
okay by what percent would you chop them?
1) Find my own communications system. Even if it means building a ton of little tiny jumpships that do nothing but carry pods full of electronic messages. Maybe not faster but not to much slower. More vulnerable to losing the message completely but safer communications and hard to interdict. This leads to point #2
Yep, a Pony Express service, finance it with "package" service like UPS. Ship's crews would have to be hardcases tho' ROM would definately do dirty tricks.
2) Pirate points and exploration. In your own realm find a ton of pirate points around your planets so if there is an invasion you can get in our out in places other than the Nadir or Zenith. This means you ComPod Jumpships can get in out with some success. The explorations means finding new resource worlds, keeping the rugged individualist and expansionist personal of your people going, place to dump malcontents or honor and promote movers and shakers. One final luck it some old Star League ship that is loaded with New Tech Mechs and is abandoned..... O I digress to Munchkin Land. But maybe other people that fled and built a whole new society with their own technology. Trick is not to over expand and stretch resources.
Yep, the major problem of finding the legendary camelot is finding the people to use it and defend it- hence the munch in a small unit ever finding one. The frontier would always absorb the malcontents who do not want to compete with/kill other humans. Your mountain men, and the homeless that just do not want civilization.
3) Build alliances with other Periphery powers to make it difficult for a big power to knock any one off. If that does not work maybe some sort of non-aggression pact. Find one weaker major power that needs some desperate resource from you, even Mech units, and send them over for a ton of knowledge and ideas. Be careful of any strings and agents that may move in with this exchange. If a Periphery power is an impediment make a deal with the weaker large power to move in and destroy them.
The problem is one neighbor is Tortuga and the other is OA. Tortuga would take a treaty thing as weakness, and OA is barely surviving. The Intelligence service has managed to recruit agents from most of the houses. while not able to go operational, it is good at keeping nosy people out. That doesn't mean that oppurtunities are not used, they just aren't created.
4) Promote space warfare improvements. Make it where it hurts to come into your territory. Plus you can move assets quickly. This allows much force against weak spots or shores them up. Also special units have cover and move quickly. Next would be infantry. Do this either via Battle Armor or conventional infantry, or both. Just increase the weapons or protection or new tactical ideas with new equipment to support this. You are making very hard for anyone to consider occupation. That alone may make people not want to invade. To make this work, invade a few pirate planets. Gives your Space crews practice and infantry, plus a few supporting units experience to pass on to others. Mechs and Vehicles are the rocks and hammers of your defense but should be limited.
On most of the border worlds the land holders support armored units, and the farmers/ranchers have a Zeus Heavy conerifle over the fireplace. they know how to shoot, and avoid stand up fights. Imagine what a platoon doing called shot on a cockpit can do, if they get enough hits. How about a system that has vetrans in charge of militias, who select promising individuals for better training? it gives the militia good professional leaders, while also getting some seasoned/ quality troops into the armor and mechs
as for space based defenses, someone found a way to shape a magnetic field, blow up a nuke and focus the radiation into certain directions. while the unit self destructs, you are likely to take at least 1 dropboat with you.
There are composite aerospace and Assault boat SDFs at key planets.
5) Determine some sort of commerical/civilian/scientfic application or common thought system and promote it. Make special universities and other incentives for people to pursue this. Like Bio Med; or Energy production; or even Entertainment. This allows keeping a happy populace and a place to expand knowledge with lesser government involvement. Also if you become a superior power in this you can trade or sell knowledge and ability to others for items you are weak in.
[i]Well there is already and education system much like the one Taurians have. people are pretty much allowed to advance as far as they can go. There are efforts to gain access to major house universities to improve quality of what is available
6) And maybe this should be first..... Establish a clear and mandatory line of succession with many variables thought of; be it monarchy, oligopoly, republic, communism, but stop the civil war, that will waste all the above items.
So far it has been using the Davion nobility rules with the "Duke" going from father to a qualified child. the population does let its choice be known thru an advisory election.
7) When the above is done...... Tell ComStar and WOB to get the hell off your planets and out of your space.
done
Okay I guess I need to add some background. This area is a sort of protectorate established by a group of local boys that joined a house military. They learned well, and went mercenary after they finished their obligated service. The place has been developing since 3000 using some funds from Davion's periphery development programs, but mainly trying to go it on their own. They have developed their own infrastructure and security and are currently setting at Star League equivalent tech (2750 readout stuff) mostly leveraged from techs and other specialists recruited by the Mercenary unit that got lucky in the financial area, and knew how to exploit oppurtunities.
The Leader does have noble recognition from House Davion, but is effectively ignored being a "country squire" type, but it is there. The title is Marquis, self inflated to Duke. They have barely survived a major attack from comstar right around 3020, this is the source of hatred and the reason for the Pony Express.
I was mainly looking for input as to what direction the realm should go. which way to jump for the Davion civil war, starleague? What other oppurtunities do you see for them?
the internal stuff is generally there, just I need a sence of plot direction.
_________________
Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side & a dark side, and strings also lie under it all.
Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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Paul
Capellan Confederation
Sang-wei
Joined: 25-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 255
Location: United States
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| Posted: 11-Dec-2003 17:53 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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On 2003-12-11 13:22, Rarich wrote:
Okay I guess I need to add some background.
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Aye, many thanks. Now I can babble something semi-useful.
But first to expand on AWAD's excellent points and your replies.
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okay by what percent would you chop them?
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A 90-95% reduction is appropriate.
What you have right now is either equivalent or superior to what the Rim Worlds Republic was. You directly compete in world and military size with any other House and could probably give most Clans a real run for their money.
MUCH too big. I'll expand on that some more down the line. But consider that the other major Periphery realms only have 20 or so worlds.
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Yep, a Pony Express service, finance it with "package" service like UPS. Ship's crews would have to be hardcases tho' ROM would definately do dirty tricks.
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Possibly, although a Pony Express type system would already handicap your economy, government and military severely. Esspecially with the size you initially proposed. They could just let the weight and consequences of that drag you down and keep you down to a managable level. Of course the odd bit of sabotage won't hurt neither. "Accidental" DropShip collision, debris sheering youyr jumpsail, something rubturing your fuel tanks, JumpShips are pretty fragile.
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Yep, the major problem of finding the legendary camelot is finding the people to use it and defend it- hence the munch in a small unit ever finding one. The frontier would always absorb the malcontents who do not want to compete with/kill other humans. Your mountain men, and the homeless that just do not want civilization.
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I wouldn't worry too much about that dynamic. People that really don't fit in end u either in jail, or as pirates. Having your own explorer corps won't remove that.
As for finding goodies, well, I wouldn't count on it. It's not like the Periphery is filled with SL storehouses. Well, the bit where WoB has it's jihad staging area is, but that's beside the point. 
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The problem is one neighbor is Tortuga and the other is OA. Tortuga would take a treaty thing as weakness, and OA is barely surviving.
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At 45 RCT's plus whatever else the heck you claim to have you should not care about either realm. With that force you could consider an invasion of the DC. And pull it off. (More so since that neck of the woods is rather thin in DCMS.)
Regardlessly, you could step on the DOminions and not notice it. The OA likewise would have little to offer you beyond AeroSPace training and a connection to CSR (Depending on what year you play)
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The Intelligence service has managed to recruit agents from most of the houses. while not able to go operational, it is good at keeping nosy people out. That doesn't mean that oppurtunities are not used, they just aren't created.
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Well, develope that angle a bit. Stick some money in to headhunting some talent, shore up your counter intel some more, and start poking. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, nor anything the lines of actual raids, but just getting an information gathering system up would be plentiful.
Once you get some HUMINT going, start an operation to see if you can get some foreign officials and officers on your payroll. Heck, why only look at officers? Non-coms.
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On most of the border worlds the land holders support armored units, and the farmers/ranchers have a Zeus Heavy conerifle over the fireplace. they know how to shoot, and avoid stand up fights. Imagine what a platoon doing called shot on a cockpit can do, if they get enough hits. How about a system that has vetrans in charge of militias, who select promising individuals for better training? it gives the militia good professional leaders, while also getting some seasoned/ quality troops into the armor and mechs
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Sounds like you've got a bad case of the Social General there. That's cool though, adds flavor.
As for infantry rifling or sniping at a Mech cockpit, your own interpretation will be key there.
MW3 rules state that that magical ferroglas has the same armor rating as the rest of a Mech's armor, which means that almost all non-support infantry weapons will do nothing but annoy that pilot.
3026 gives EVERY weapon a chance to penetrate, even sidearms.
IOW, you can argue it whichever way you want to for your campaign. You want your rednecks to be that powerful, go for it.
I wouldn't, but that'd be my campaign.
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as for space based defenses, someone found a way to shape a magnetic field, blow up a nuke and focus the radiation into certain directions. while the unit self destructs, you are likely to take at least 1 dropboat with you.
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Cool, so when will you be deploying tractor beams and graviton engines?
Bit hokey, questionable SF, but again, the main focus is that this is your campaign. You want them to have directional nukes, you got em.
Of course, since you've got suicide units (drones?) doing it, why not stick to missiles instead? A nuke's a nuke, your targets won't survive one like the Galactica might, plus with missiles you don't loose a unit.
Likewise, you could create your own 'missile' which'd be little more than an engine mounted on one of those directional nukes.
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There are composite aerospace and Assault boat SDFs at key planets.
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Assault boats being Small Craft?
Any numbers with that?
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[i]Well there is already and education system much like the one Taurians have. people are pretty much allowed to advance as far as they can go. There are efforts to gain access to major house universities to improve quality of what is available
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So, are there any actual downsides to this nation of yours, or is it just a Utopia all around?
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So far it has been using the Davion nobility rules with the "Duke" going from father to a qualified child. the population does let its choice be known thru an advisory election.
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How does that work? Joe is in the line of succession, the people choose Bob, second after Joe, so Bob gets the job?
So basically you have an elitist oligarchical(sp?) semi-republic?
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Tell ComStar and WOB to get the hell off your planets and out of your space.
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done
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That reminds me. What is the average level of education, compared to the US system of that nation? And what about religious beliefs?
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This area is a sort of protectorate established by a group of local boys that joined a house military. They learned well, and went mercenary after they finished their obligated service. The place has been developing since 3000 using some funds from Davion's periphery development programs, but mainly trying to go it on their own.
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Since when do the Davions develope the Periphery near the DC?
Since when do a couple of local boys build up an army upwards of 45 RCTs in like 50-60 years that stretches accross 325 planets?
And where does the actual population come from? How much do they number?
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They have developed their own infrastructure and security and are currently setting at Star League equivalent tech (2750 readout stuff) mostly leveraged from techs and other specialists recruited by the Mercenary unit that got lucky in the financial area, and knew how to exploit oppurtunities.
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That's pretty amazing. That'd mean they basically outdid ALL of the 5 Houses combined when it comes to raising infrastructure and acquiring knowledge.
Given that they started from a merc unit.
Those Wolf's Dragoons look a lot less cheezey now.
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The Leader does have noble recognition from House Davion, but is effectively ignored being a "country squire" type, but it is there. The title is Marquis, self inflated to Duke. They have barely survived a major attack from comstar right around 3020, this is the source of hatred and the reason for the Pony Express.
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What was the reason for the attack?
Also a bit strange that the emperor of a sovereign nation calls himself Duke.
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I was mainly looking for input as to what direction the realm should go. which way to jump for the Davion civil war, starleague? What other oppurtunities do you see for them?
the internal stuff is generally there, just I need a sence of plot direction.
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Alrighty, got a bit more to work with.
Davion Civil War. Whoever this Duke supports, wins. He has more resources, power, industry and economy behind him than either the Haseks or the Sandovals combined.
Star League, why not join? Gives your PCs some nice politics to struggle with.
Jihad, don't know if you care for it. If you do, a couple of visits by WoB'd make sense. They'd be less interested in rubbing out your military as they would be in taking out those few production facilities, universities and maybe your capital city. Also they'd do themselves a favor by trying to cripple as much of your JumpShip fleet as possible; you're low already, your communication ability will be 0, and you can't move your massive army anywhere, IE the IS, to do any good.
And no way to contact the IS for some transport neither.
In general, what is the scope you want to play on? Leaving your realm at it's current size makes it a top 6 Inner Sphere player, despite it's position. Plenty of oppertunity for intrigue there. Plenty of reason to have neighbors raid you, even declare war on you. You're a threat, whether you intend to be one or not. Plus it's all too easy for a 3rd nation to stage a few incidents which result in war between you and, say, the FS. The Cappies would love that, Feddies die, and they don't have to lift a mussle. Oh, and some irrelevant nation also suffers, bonus.
A similar scenario can be made for the DC.
So basically, what type of games do you intend or hope to be playing? Low level stuff? High level stuff? Lot's of combat? Lots of politics? Or a combination?
Paul
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 11-Dec-2003 23:35 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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Aye, many thanks. Now I can babble something semi-useful.
But first to expand on AWAD's excellent points and your replies.
A 90-95% reduction is appropriate.
how about more like 50% that would give me less than the Taurians. The vast majority are really agricutural oriented and are mainly looking for some one to call when pirates hit with mechs. Otherwise the land/industry owners have the wealth to support armor. Most of these people are people attracted by the promise of Homestead land. If they prove it up and make it profitable it is theirs. A large portion of the colonists are retired veterans.
What you have right now is either equivalent or superior to what the Rim Worlds Republic was. You directly compete in world and military size with any other House and could probably give most Clans a real run for their money.
Not really about 70% of the RCTs are Conventional, no mechs or maybe a company of old model light mechs. I do not have a lot of transport to move them around either. only the elite units are permanent RCTs with mechs.
MUCH too big. I'll expand on that some more down the line. But consider that the other major Periphery realms only have 20 or so worlds.
those are only the ones worth visiting for trade. there was some fluff mebtioning that not all the planets were represented. The Marches of the FedSuns have a couple of hundred apiece. I counted in the fedsuns source book.
a Pony Express type system would already handicap your economy, government and military severely. Esspecially with the size you initially proposed. They could just let the weight and consequences of that drag you down and keep you down to a managable level. Of course the odd bit of sabotage won't hurt neither. "Accidental" DropShip collision, debris sheering youyr jumpsail, something rubturing your fuel tanks, JumpShips are pretty fragile.
how would it drag my economy down, between the package service helping to open up tradelanes, and charging a fee for the communications? The idea was to make things self financing, a visit on key worlds every couple of weeks and skid row worlds about twice a year?
It's not like the Periphery is filled with SL storehouses. Well, the bit where WoB has it's jihad staging area is, but that's beside the point.
welllll, there is the snord camelot, and the star's end nebula stuff. If the SLDF had anything really major, Kerensky would have run there instead of into the great unknown.
At 45 RCT's plus whatever else the heck you claim to have you should not care about either realm. With that force you could consider an invasion of the DC. And pull it off. (More so since that neck of the woods is
rather thin in DCMS.)
Nope, to keep the pirates out once and for all, I would have to take and hold those worlds. I don't have the people to do that, with garrisons and such. As for the DC, I do not want to give the ISF any excuses to take action, between them and a few RCTs they could turn this place back to 3000 in a couple of months. WOB could do the same thing if I went a' conquistadoring. As it is I am in the same boat a Phelan Kell, a massive chicken bone. As it is the pirates give me something to blood new units on every 5-10 years.
Well, develope that angle a bit. Stick some money in to headhunting some talent, shore up your counter intel some more, and start poking. It doesn't have to be anything fancy, nor anything the lines of actual raids, but just getting an information gathering system up would be plentiful.
Once you get some HUMINT going, start an operation to see if you can get some foreign officials and officers on your payroll. Heck, why only look at officers? Non-coms.
working at that. The main problem is people, the population levels on all the planets is low. I do try and recruit Inner Sphere talent, but how sure of their loyalty can I be? I understand the idea of paying off some one to pass technical manuals to me, but I still need a control officer. Where along the chain can I risk a disloyal Operator?
Sounds like you've got a bad case of the Social General there. That's cool though, adds flavor.
Actually the landholder are more the owners of the tractor factory and such. they can build the tanks. A large portion of them would be retired Techs form the InnerSpere I would have recruited. Some of them even veterans with technical knowledge. In most cases a retired warrior of some sort has actual command of the unit, but of course there is an influence trade off. I could easily see a scenario where the populace gets tired of Mr. Deere putting on airs about "his" Cavalry unit. I hope Mr. deere realizes that such behavior enhance the probability of a hunting accident. A Zeuss Rifle also shoots a LONG way.
As for infantry rifling or sniping at a Mech cockpit, your own interpretation will be key there.
MW3 rules state that that magical ferroglas has the same armor rating as the rest of a Mech's armor, which means that almost all non-support infantry weapons will do nothing but annoy that pilot.
3026 gives EVERY weapon a chance to penetrate, even sidearms.
IOW, you can argue it whichever way you want to for your campaign. You want your rednecks to be that powerful, go for it.
I wouldn't, but that'd be my campaign.
well, the zeus heavy cone rifle (These would be the quivalent of .50 caliber sniper rifles) has damage in excess of the amount given for 1 armor point according to the conversion given in MW (MWII compainion P. 47). I figured if each rifle can do 1 point per hit, and the whole platoon is trying for the cockpit......
A single "redneck" would have to hit 10 or more times,pretty hard to do with called shots.
Bit hokey, questionable SF, but again, the main focus is that this is your campaign. You want them to have directional nukes, you got em.
not so the explosion is still normally shaped, the radiation is shaped , basically you are using a massive PPC. there is no barrel or chamber since space serves that purpose, the magnetic bottle stuff lasts just long enough to get the beam focused in the right direction. think of a flash bulb with a reflector, only the reflector goes with the flash too.
missiles would be nice, but it is easier to plant these like mines in a specific relation to the jumpoints, then it is pretty stealthy, looking like a chunk of rock until the fusion reactor powers up. We are not talking a bomb, were are talking about intentionally melting down a reactor to get the radiation for the beam. Heck something similar was in our Starwars/SDI stuff, not raygun sci-fi.
Assault boats being Small Craft?
Any numbers with that?
Yes, about 12 assault boats per key system, patrolling, in maintenance, and "hiding" mostly jurry rigged leopard CV's and a few new Achilles that are being produced at one of the space yards. There were more but the Comstar raid in 3020 destroyed a lot of them.
usually there are 2 aerofighters with each assault boat, 6 with a CV. there is an aerospace wing assigned to key planets, other planets will have either a squadron or lance otherwise.
So, are there any actual downsides to this nation of yours, or is it just a Utopia all around?
well, what is available is more of an apprenticeship system more tham formal university. The Master level people have been to an academy or college. the percentage of college level people would be about 20% on a key/core world to less than 5% on the skid row worlds. There are currently only 2 colleges and 4 academies. The academies are military oriented and are generally getting along like the Kilborne and Bolan academies in the Fedsuns. Only they turn over a lot more people. The colleges are more book oriented and mainly serve as a way to keep the few academics organized and safe. The students usually come in for a year for some focused study on a subject to do something (how build a dam) rather than a full degree.
how does that work? Joe is in the line of succession, the people choose Bob, second after Joe, so Bob gets the job?
So basically you have an elitist oligarchical(sp?) semi-republic?
The succession has happened twice already with only 1 obvious candidate each time. The advisory election lets the leadership know what percentage of the population would like to see a particular individual take over, and also which way they want to go in the future.
A lot of things are still settling out, I guess a "contitutional convention" scenario is going to need played out. There is a definate Davion style leaning. Hey, it the periphery, as long as it works.......
Since when do the Davions develope the Periphery near the DC?
Look in the davion source book (the PDF is at CBT) Nobilty:marquis and Periphery Policy: second/third paragraph. Of course the OA is in the way of developing on the DC periphery. Try the direction of McRae-BrokenWheel, out the periphery end of the Crucis March, not the Draconis March.
Since when do a couple of local boys build up an army upwards of 45 RCTs in like 50-60 years that stretches accross 325 planets?
Luck, some seriously hot die rolls during a contact default, during recruiting, and some shrewd use of fluff. The mercs are still working for cash and funneling most of the profit and salvage into development.
Lots of the planets are in a barter set up. We'll send you x food/ore, you defend us. type of situation. They are counted since there is a contract there. but you do that thru a lot of planets, you get the $$$ to afford the military units. Like I said before a lot of the RCTs lack a mech unit, but they do make pirate raids very dangerous.
And where does the actual population come from? How much do they number?
from local natives, from colonists volunteering for homesteads. there are 2 generations of retired/ invalided mercenaries that are making contributions. The population is mainly what was in place, some people were moved off of exotic planets where they could not survive well. Others actually got effective defense and sanitation. Volunteers from various "Colonialistic" organizations too.
Quantity? Never enough, that is the major sticking point.
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That's pretty amazing. That'd mean they basically outdid ALL of the 5 Houses combined when it comes to raising infrastructure and acquiring knowledge.
Given that they started from a merc unit.
Those Wolf's Dragoons look a lot less cheezey now.
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House Steiner added mountain wolf, blueshot, arc royal and expanded the Hesperus and Coventry facilities in a period from 3050-3055. most of the others added a facility in about 5 years time. I averaged about twice that time per facility.
They developed McRae. and Home mech facilites in about 30 years, the two space yards took 10 years apiece, and the one jumpship yard would just be starting to produce in 3050 (they have been overhauling since about 3030). The armor production I regard as being a regular part of tractor and automotive tech wich was already present.
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What was the reason for the attack?
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you have heard of Comstar's Holy Shroud operations? The development in the periphery were ruining a lot of the leverage Comstar had. This was also a sign that people were recovering without the aid of "blessed Blake" and Comstar. ROM would definately do something, and tried. Things were then escalated to big raids on McRae, Home and a couple of other worlds. The Comguard was of regular quality then, going up against 2 Merc RCTs or elite and veteran quality, plus regular militia and SDFs on the "facility worlds". It was ugly, they did some damage, but they lost. The technology they left on those battlefields is why starleague level of tech is available.
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Also a bit strange that the emperor of a sovereign nation calls himself Duke.
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well, the FedSuns have a proprietary interest in what is developing. Having granted a Marquee ship, they have a certain amount of leverage at McRae. This is the original merc land hold where one of the facilities sets. Home, Rolinstone, Morituri station, Penzance and sessendam are all in the periphery and were never FedSun territory. Declaring oneself emperor would lose oneself the McRae landhold and gain the formal attention of the 1st Prince rather than benign inattention.
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Davion Civil War. Whoever this Duke supports, wins. He has more resources, power, industry and economy behind him than either the Haseks or the Sandovals combined.
I regard it as about even, they have a massive population advantage. The Duke has some nice "house units" but little else.
Star League, why not join? Gives your PCs some nice politics to struggle with.
Jihad, don't know if you care for it. If you do, a couple of visits by WoB'd make sense. They'd be less interested in rubbing out your military as they would be in taking out those few production facilities, universities and maybe your capital city. Also they'd do themselves a favor by trying to cripple as much of your JumpShip fleet as possible; you're low already, your communication ability will be 0, and you can't move your massive army anywhere, IE the IS, to do any good.
And no way to contact the IS for some transport neither.
In general, what is the scope you want to play on? Leaving your realm at it's current size makes it a top 6 Inner Sphere player, despite it's position. Plenty of oppertunity for intrigue there. Plenty of reason to have neighbors raid you, even declare war on you. You're a threat, whether you intend to be one or not. Plus it's all too easy for a 3rd nation to stage a few incidents which result in war between you and, say, the FS. The Cappies would love that, Feddies die, and they don't have to lift a mussle. Oh, and some irrelevant nation also suffers, bonus.
A similar scenario can be made for the DC.
So basically, what type of games do you intend or hope to be playing? Low level stuff? High level stuff? Lot's of combat? Lots of politics? Or a combination?
Paul
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I am just looking for what you are giving me. A reality check plus some sticky tricks to play on the group. There is low level stuff happening to develop the kids, high level stuff to keep things interesting. The combat is on the company/lance level in an aspect of a battle. politics are strictly roleplaying. The covert activity is roleplayed. I have about 8 people interested in diferent aspects. 2 here 2 there, so it is complicated.
I doubt the Fedsuns/ realm war option would work. They know too much about each other. Some ISF action with the DC would give incentive for an intelligence war. As would some WOB action, maybe they are blooding operatives too.
They are currently trying to get the jumpyards up to speed and develop compact core, and system drive capability. I know ROM will be seriously acting on that. there have been security steps taken there.
They decided to remain neutral for the civil war, and lost a lot of ground on their development schedule due to pressure from Katherine on shipping.
There are several other Ideas I have percolating, but I want to see what other people come up with, without biasing anyone with my ideas.
I am also trying to get a handle on how to get this campaign resonably "canonized" since it had developed its timeline past the clans before FASA bombshelled them in on us.
The Jihad is going to not exist in the timeline, but the F-C civil war will have to. You should have seen the stuff I had running around when this campaign was at 3075!
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Motown Scrapper
Clan Ice Hellions
Galaxy Commander
Joined: 24-Jul-2003 00:00
Posts: 2074
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Dec-2003 00:39 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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You might want to take a look at what other people have done.I have an outer perephery realm called the Outland Alliance with 43 planets, it is about 10% of the size of yours .If you go to the fiction forum here you can find a piece on the history of it called "Outer Peraphery Realm:Outland Alliance"you should be able to get some ideas there ,also if you go to the P.R.I. site (the link is posted on the link site )you can find a number of peices on the Veiled Republic by Greys Shadows he has a lot of detail there. It is a small nation only 7 planets but the information is VERY detailed.
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Paul
Capellan Confederation
Sang-wei
Joined: 25-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 255
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Dec-2003 10:36 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. [LONG] |
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Edit: Good LORD! That post ended up huge! My apologies to everyone using flat mode...
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On 2003-12-11 23:35, Rarich wrote:
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A 90-95% reduction is appropriate.
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how about more like 50% that would give me less than the Taurians.
those are only the ones worth visiting for trade. there was some fluff mebtioning that not all the planets were represented. The Marches of the FedSuns have a couple of hundred apiece. I counted in the fedsuns source book.
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I think you're misunderstanding some fluff. The numbers in Combat Operations (I'll post those when I get back home) for instance indicate the number of *inhabited* planets in each realm.
Which does include a whole boatload of semi-worthless agricultural planets. Your ratio there seems fine, even the number of factories you have, it's just that you've given yourself 325 worlds, which is roughly equivalent to the FWL, IIRC. There are currently 2200ish known inhabited planets in BT, including Clan Space.
The TC and MoC really do have around 20 worlds, as does the OA. Unmarked populated worlds exist only if they're undiscovered, which'd disqualify them as a component of any known realm.
Now, that said, I'd like to stress once again that this is your campaign, and my opinion on what the background seems to indicate shouldn't bother you too much. Use what works for you, regardless of the ' facts'. If you have an easier time having fun with 325 worlds in your realm, keep em.
That general remark goes for anything I say.
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The vast majority are really agricutural oriented and are mainly looking for some one to call when pirates hit with mechs. Otherwise the land/industry owners have the wealth to support armor. Most of these people are people attracted by the promise of Homestead land. If they prove it up and make it profitable it is theirs. A large portion of the colonists are retired veterans.
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This is true in any realm. Still, colonization proceeds slowly; it is more economical and easier to protect strategically to group on 1 world. 100 settlements of 1,000 people each spread over 100 worlds are a lot harder to defend then those 100 settlements on 1 world. Worlds are large, so if you find a good one agriculturally, you can pile several million, if not billion on there before running out of room.
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Not really about 70% of the RCTs are Conventional, no mechs or maybe a company of old model light mechs. I do not have a lot of transport to move them around either. only the elite units are permanent RCTs with mechs.
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I think you're using the term RCT too loosely then. Also, not making it a permanent structure is a waste of time, training and red tape. I'd recomment grouping militia units on worlds by the regiment, and perhaps only organizing them as a brigade if you have a whole chunk of of on 1 rock. Otherwise just let the planetary commander's staff coordinate the couple of regiments.
30% Mechs is still 13.5 worth of Mech regiments/ Mech RCTs.
Half of which apparently are elite rated.
Ah, the fromage! Tres bien!
Alright, the 30% Mech ratio does tone things down a bit, but that still means you have 45 x 3 = 135 armor regiments and 45 x 6 = 270 infantry regiments (rough average) spread accross 325 worlds. Definitely not wise to organize that as RCTs since you'll concentrate far too much force on a fraction of your total worlds. The time it takes your RCT to mount up and move to a world under pirate attack is probably more than the pirates need to go in, grab what they want, steal your women and rape your horses, and get out.
A better idea would be to spread the conventional regiments around based on a world's relative importance, ideally paring at least 1 infy and 1 armor regiment. Leave some lesser worlds unprotected.
Then set the Mechs up as a rapid response force. Some on central worlds, ready to lift off to support any raid immediately, provided the militia bogs them down, or to try and track pirates down after a hit.
Other could patrol the worlds at random intervals, and/or actively hunt for pirates.
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how would it drag my economy down, between the package service helping to open up tradelanes, and charging a fee for the communications? The idea was to make things self financing, a visit on key worlds every couple of weeks and skid row worlds about twice a year?
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Make it self financing? Good lord, most of your worlds can't afford that.
Regardlessly, how well do you think the US economy would do if you get to transmit information between major states every couple of weeks, and lesser states about twice a year?
Because of the tremendous size of your realm, your inability to communicate in a meaningful manner (IE, you might not know your skidrow worlds got conquered for 5-6 months) will pretty much restrict your economy to the planet itself. You'd have some gain from having additional markets to unload, but you'd basically get a econmic strength response equivalent to that of the colonies in the 1500s.
Fluff, in particular that in the C* book is very explicit how heavily the various realms were struggling until HPG was invented. And an Interdiction does cripple a realm. IE Tharkad, whole FWL. The DC was a bit prepared when they had that faceoff over the Coordinator's sister (IIRC) but likely would've suffered considerably.
So the drag isn't the actual cost of the system (which could be considerable, given the rules of supply and demand), it's more the effect the super slow communications will have on your realm.
If anything, this almost completely balances your realm with the current BT fluff. You're big, but can't be expected to be a threat of consequence.
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welllll, there is the snord camelot, and the star's end nebula stuff. If the SLDF had anything really major, Kerensky would have run there instead of into the great unknown.
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That facility are documented as being pretty high-end. There won't be more Camelot Command's, nor other type bases in another Dark Nebula somewhere.
And the SLDF would have gone on regardlessly. Alex' wacky plan was to isolate the best and the brightest of the SL until the war had died out a decade or two or 3 later. Then come back. Well, the Pentagon Civil War kinda cludged that up. As did ComStar and the 5 Houses doing their best to keep the Succession Wars going. (C* taking all the credit for that is too arrogant. They're the straw that broke the camel's back, but thats all. Their effect on science is far greater.)
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Nope, to keep the pirates out once and for all, I would have to take and hold those worlds. I don't have the people to do that, with garrisons and such.
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Yes you do. 13 Mech regiments plus support elements, well, if you just bring your elite and vet Mech RCTs, all 13-14 of em, you'd crush all the pirates and have PLENTY of conventional forces to garrison against a repeat.
And since your main and only threat, from the looks of things, are the pirates, you can afford an operation like that. More so since you can expect it to not last too long. They're more likely to flee than stand and fight against those odds. Hmm, key would be to make em think they have a fighting chance. Perhaps send in Mechs only, but move the Mechs in troop carriers so they think they have to deal with infantry instead. You'll need some time to unload the Mechs from cargo, but it could work.
How many Mechs etc do you see those pirates as having anyway? Most pirates listed in FM:U are kinda tiny.
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As for the DC, I do not want to give the ISF any excuses to take action, between them and a few RCTs they could turn this place back to 3000 in a couple of months.
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The DCMS doesn't use RCTs, plus would have to deal with your huge and highly skilled military. With their Clan and FS front, they can't afford extended operations. Limited operations could nab some worlds, and keep them. More so if you plan to loose a world or 2 from a DCMS counterstrike as to allow them to save face.
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WOB could do the same thing if I went a' conquistadoring.
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Why would WoB care? They're more likely to put on their kneepads and start apologizing, trying to subvert your nice lil realm.
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As it is I am in the same boat a Phelan Kell, a massive chicken bone. As it is the pirates give me something to blood new units on every 5-10 years.
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That's a T-Rex sized chicken.
The pirate dynamic does make sense. But if thats your reason for leaving them around to torment your people... Hiring your military out to other people's wars would be a better PR way at the same thing. See if the FS is interested.
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working at that. The main problem is people, the population levels on all the planets is low. I do try and recruit Inner Sphere talent, but how sure of their loyalty can I be? I understand the idea of paying off some one to pass technical manuals to me, but I still need a control officer. Where along the chain can I risk a disloyal Operator?
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This is a problem for any intel organization. You'll have to deal with it. True, you have a good point, recruiting in the IS does open you up for infiltration.
Still, setting up a few operations down the line to test your lines works. Drop some bogus info around, see where it ends up.
See what happens when you act on some information. Always have a contingency in case you get burned.
Always have multiple layers. If you pick up the same vibe from 10 different contacts, many of which in different elements of the enemy nation (military, government, civilian, mercenary, criminal, etc) something's going on. That something might still be an immensely compromised intel organization on your end, or a highly successful misinformation campaign, but usually you just shouldn't be in a position to find yourself in a do-or-die situation based on intel alone.
If you maintain your current size, you'll be pretty high profile. Expect a LOT of attention. If you dumb it down to a more general Periphery size, you can get away with being that guy in the corner no one notices or cares about. At which point all you do is listen, and just about never act.
Regardlessly, plenty of ammo for PCs there.
Hello Angels! We're picking up data that the Suns might be sending the Crucis Lancers this way. Yes, all of em. Go there and see what's going on.
Yes Charlie!
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Sounds like you've got a bad case of the Social General there. That's cool though, adds flavor.
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Actually the landholder are more the owners of the tractor factory and such. they can build the tanks. A large portion of them would be retired Techs form the InnerSpere I would have recruited. Some of them even veterans with technical knowledge. In most cases a retired warrior of some sort has actual command of the unit, but of course there is an influence trade off. I could easily see a scenario where the populace gets tired of Mr. Deere putting on airs about "his" Cavalry unit. I hope Mr. deere realizes that such behavior enhance the probability of a hunting accident. A Zeuss Rifle also shoots a LONG way.
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What? Peasants popping off prominents because they feel crossed? So now it's secretly a semi-organized anarchy? You vote with your rifle?
What if Joe Bob Bubkiss decides that your militia commander, who promoted that no-good Billy-Bob and his brother Cletus to command because they married his daughter, (yes, both of them) really should be rubbed out? Your government just shrugs, says "yeah, I guess he it coming Joe Bob. Wanna be the commander instead?"
Relying on people to only shoot those in command for the right reasons is banking on a general distribution of a quality of judgement clearly not in evidence.
You've definitely got a Social General problem if your tractor producer ends up being the militia commander. That's how the whole social general thing got started anyway.
And if the main means of advancing in your career is your CO pulling or cutting strings, well, then your system is set up the politically proficient, not the skilled.
Sure, you'll have the odd commander who looks at skills alone. But if you've been exposed to any commercial or military environment, you'll know how bad things can get *with* some checks and balances in place. What are yours?
Final point: just recruiting a Tech doesn't mean you've got a man who can build you a factory including all the machinery you need to make the parts you need.
It means you got a man who knows how to fix a tractor/tank/mech/whatever.
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well, the zeus heavy cone rifle (These would be the quivalent of .50 caliber sniper rifles) has damage in excess of the amount given for 1 armor point according to the conversion given in MW (MWII compainion P. 47). I figured if each rifle can do 1 point per hit, and the whole platoon is trying for the cockpit......
A single "redneck" would have to hit 10 or more times,pretty hard to do with called shots.
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Well, MW3 works with armor thresholds for infantry weapons. If you don't have enough AP to cross the threshold, you don;t do any damage at all. Much more balanced.
Mixing a 1 damage infantry weapon (you might want to check that math, and/or redo it with the MW3 infantry formula's in Combat Ops) with RPG skills, well, that's pretty cheezey.
But again, key here is what you *want*. Esspecially with infantry, you can explain a lot of things any which way you want.
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not so the explosion is still normally shaped, the radiation is shaped , basically you are using a massive PPC. there is no barrel or chamber since space serves that purpose, the magnetic bottle stuff lasts just long enough to get the beam focused in the right direction. think of a flash bulb with a reflector, only the reflector goes with the flash too.
missiles would be nice, but it is easier to plant these like mines in a specific relation to the jumpoints, then it is pretty stealthy, looking like a chunk of rock until the fusion reactor powers up. We are not talking a bomb, were are talking about intentionally melting down a reactor to get the radiation for the beam. Heck something similar was in our Starwars/SDI stuff, not raygun sci-fi.
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The SDI stuff is a nuke on a plate. The plate slow the explosion down a bit and causes slightly more force to be directed in the opposite direction. Basically a shaped charge atomic.
Your idea is completely different.
A fusion reactor runs on a small amount of mass. A controlled rupture would basically be equivalent to a BT flamer. Maybe a bit more, but not the kind of effect you're looking for.
Bigger reactors, well, why aren't you sticking them in Mechs?
Also, space does not serve any positive purpose for a charged particle attack; the vaccuum would disperse the force much faster than it would in an atmosphere.
Finally, mines at a JumpPoint are pointless. It's way too big. So unless you've got an engine on those mines, or fluff that their area of effect is a few hundred thousand km, you're wasting money.
You are right though, they'll be pretty much undetectable. I pity the Invader that PPCs that bit of space debris (just in case). =)
Now, fluffing a one-shot PPC type thing, I can see that. You would need a chamber and barrel for that one, however, you could BS a higher yield on one of those compared to the repetitive normal PPC.
But then I have to ask why you're not using PPCs on your military. And if you have a surplus production, why you're not making a buck off of it.
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Yes, about 12 assault boats per key system, patrolling, in maintenance, and "hiding" mostly jurry rigged leopard CV's and a few new Achilles that are being produced at one of the space yards. There were more but the Comstar raid in 3020 destroyed a lot of them.
usually there are 2 aerofighters with each assault boat, 6 with a CV. there is an aerospace wing assigned to key planets, other planets will have either a squadron or lance otherwise.
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Very large force. You may have denser ASF protection than the CC and FWL. (poorly documented except for the forces attached to ground units) Do you attach any ASFs to your RCTs?
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well, what is available is more of an apprenticeship system more tham formal university. The Master level people have been to an academy or college. the percentage of college level people would be about 20% on a key/core world to less than 5% on the skid row worlds. There are currently only 2 colleges and 4 academies. The academies are military oriented and are generally getting along like the Kilborne and Bolan academies in the Fedsuns. Only they turn over a lot more people. The colleges are more book oriented and mainly serve as a way to keep the few academics organized and safe. The students usually come in for a year for some focused study on a subject to do something (how build a dam) rather than a full degree.
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I like it.
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The succession has happened twice already with only 1 obvious candidate each time. The advisory election lets the leadership know what percentage of the population would like to see a particular individual take over, and also which way they want to go in the future.
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What if 70% hates the guy/girl that's lined up?
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A lot of things are still settling out, I guess a "contitutional convention" scenario is going to need played out. There is a definate Davion style leaning. Hey, it the periphery, as long as it works.......
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The Davions wouldn't hear about the public deciding whose next in line. Eyeball their 3-way civil war for how they handle things.
Yvonne thought the realm was going down the crapper, and thus abdicated in favor of a more worthy scion. I suppose you could view that as the public 'voting' more or less, but that's the extent of it. Plus and Davion worth their weight in manure would just spin the news services differently. Yvonne was too green and lacked advisors.
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Look in the davion source book (the PDF is at CBT) Nobilty:marquis and Periphery Policy: second/third paragraph. Of course the OA is in the way of developing on the DC periphery. Try the direction of McRae-BrokenWheel, out the periphery end of the Crucis March, not the Draconis March.
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Thanks on getting me straight on the locale.
Marquis (I have the DavionSB at home, I'll doublecheck my assumptions when I get back) develope *single* worlds with limited to no support. No way in heck does the FS have the resources to exploit and colonize 325 planets.
The OA is not a DC protectorate, it started out as it's own thing, and has surrendered a boatload of worlds to the DC over the years. If you see your realm having that kind of relationship with the FS, well, you're a busy lad then. =)
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Luck, some seriously hot die rolls during a contact default, during recruiting, and some shrewd use of fluff. The mercs are still working for cash and funneling most of the profit and salvage into development.
Lots of the planets are in a barter set up. We'll send you x food/ore, you defend us. type of situation. They are counted since there is a contract there. but you do that thru a lot of planets, you get the $$$ to afford the military units. Like I said before a lot of the RCTs lack a mech unit, but they do make pirate raids very dangerous.
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Those are some dice!
BT economics precludes such a huge growth out of nothing. You wont have enough surplus left.
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from local natives, from colonists volunteering for homesteads. there are 2 generations of retired/ invalided mercenaries that are making contributions. The population is mainly what was in place, some people were moved off of exotic planets where they could not survive well. Others actually got effective defense and sanitation. Volunteers from various "Colonialistic" organizations too.
Quantity? Never enough, that is the major sticking point.
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I don't see how you'd get enough hot bodies that way to colonize 1 world, let alone 325.
The population was already in place? What, the IS lost some 300 colonies somewhere in that neck of the woods?
1-2 might be explained, colonies cut off, self sustained and lasting until you find em, but 300?
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House Steiner added mountain wolf, blueshot, arc royal and expanded the Hesperus and Coventry facilities in a period from 3050-3055. most of the others added a facility in about 5 years time. I averaged about twice that time per facility.
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The majority of new factories are re-activated plants that simply ran out of the components to produce their Mechs.
That said, I've always maintained that the industrial revolution is a crock of shit. Somewhere between 3030 and 3055, all this started up again? (not 3050, BTW)
Its not your number of factories that's amazing. Well, not just that. It's the infrastructure popping up out of nowhere. The various Houses had an infrastructure before the 1st War. Lots of it got nuked, lots dried up, lots remained. They just revitalized it. (Dont ask me how)
You have to start in the stone age and build up. With the base resources of a wealthy and successful Merc company, not an engineering concern with contracts on a few hundred worlds in the IS.
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They developed McRae. and Home mech facilites in about 30 years, the two space yards took 10 years apiece, and the one jumpship yard would just be starting to produce in 3050 (they have been overhauling since about 3030). The armor production I regard as being a regular part of tractor and automotive tech wich was already present.
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Well, you either have very crappy tanks, or tractors that can double as dinosaur killers and demolition vehicles.
Let's see Deere make an M1.
Shipyards are more complex than Mech factories. As for Mech factories, read the fluff in the Companion.
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you have heard of Comstar's Holy Shroud operations? The development in the periphery were ruining a lot of the leverage Comstar had. This was also a sign that people were recovering without the aid of "blessed Blake" and Comstar. ROM would definately do something, and tried. Things were then escalated to big raids on McRae, Home and a couple of other worlds. The Comguard was of regular quality then, going up against 2 Merc RCTs or elite and veteran quality, plus regular militia and SDFs on the "facility worlds". It was ugly, they did some damage, but they lost. The technology they left on those battlefields is why starleague level of tech is available.
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Definitely a plausible angle, if you maintain your reported rate of growth.
But just because you salvage a Lancelot doesn't mean you can start producing them.
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well, the FedSuns have a proprietary interest in what is developing.
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Hell yeah! Thats a nice March that's developing there.
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Having granted a Marquee ship, they have a certain amount of leverage at McRae. This is the original merc land hold where one of the facilities sets. Home, Rolinstone, Morituri station, Penzance and sessendam are all in the periphery and were never FedSun territory. Declaring oneself emperor would lose oneself the McRae landhold and gain the formal attention of the 1st Prince rather than benign inattention.
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True.
So, the FS thinks those 325 worlds are basically all a part of the FS? Have they tried to redeploy your military forces yet? If not, why not? I'd rotate those juicy elite units out to Drac or Clanner duty in no time, put some green crap there instead. Prob redeploy the militia too.
That effort would put stress between you and the FS and gives you a reason for some strife, even skirmishes and a war of independence.
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I regard it as about even, they have a massive population advantage. The Duke has some nice "house units" but little else.
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But that's what it's all about. Your military, while not as huge as I initially thought, will make a HUGE difference in that conflict.
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I am just looking for what you are giving me. A reality check plus some sticky tricks to play on the group. There is low level stuff happening to develop the kids, high level stuff to keep things interesting. The combat is on the company/lance level in an aspect of a battle. politics are strictly roleplaying. The covert activity is roleplayed. I have about 8 people interested in diferent aspects. 2 here 2 there, so it is complicated.
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Definitely. Hard to please such a diverse crowd, keep things interesting for them.
Still, your setting has the potential. Whether you decide to keep it, or play in to my fickle whim and biased perspective on BT reality.
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I doubt the Fedsuns/ realm war option would work. They know too much about each other.
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No guarantee. See above. Distrust starts easily, esspecially when one nation starts taking liberties with the other, some poor diplomacy starts occuring, or one just feels sleighted by the other.
Any statement can be explained in a positive and negative light, so all you need is a bit of paranoia and distrust and things can begin to deteriorate.
Plus, what if an actual independence or seperatist movement starts up in your realm? Or one funded by another nation? Enough provocation and the FS might feel obligated to ' pacify' or ' neutralize' the situation.
If you want to go there, you can.
If you don't you don't have to.
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Some ISF action with the DC would give incentive for an intelligence war. As would some WOB action, maybe they are blooding operatives too.
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Certainly. Mind you, intel wars are rarely james bond like. Just as easy to get spies booted out.
Even better to leave em be. A known spy is a powerful tool in your favor.
Or a risk you ignored.
Fun how everything can go in multiple directions.
Always remember that the best laid plans can go in the crapper. Not just from your enemy, but it'll be fun to take a PC's plot and spend some time to see how you can make it spin out of control, or have unanticipated side effects.
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They are currently trying to get the jumpyards up to speed and develop compact core, and system drive capability. I know ROM will be seriously acting on that. there have been security steps taken there.
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There is no way you can explain that developement within the constraints of BT. The Houses were stuck on that until ComStar told em how to pull it off.
So now the FS is going to give you the data you need so you can make the shipyards in some backwater area of their realm? Well, that's fine, but then we'll stick some nice FS security forces there. Nope, sorry, no control there, and we'll be taking that production, thank you. There's a good little March lord.
And yeah, others will respond to that as well.
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They decided to remain neutral for the civil war, and lost a lot of ground on their development schedule due to pressure from Katherine on shipping.
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Seems like a missed oppertunity, but the effects are reasonable.
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There are several other Ideas I have percolating, but I want to see what other people come up with, without biasing anyone with my ideas.
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Good idea. Although down the line I'd love to try to comment or expand on ideas you might have.
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I am also trying to get a handle on how to get this campaign resonably "canonized" since it had developed its timeline past the clans before FASA bombshelled them in on us.
The Jihad is going to not exist in the timeline, but the F-C civil war will have to. You should have seen the stuff I had running around when this campaign was at 3075!
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Well, it's tough to link back up because of the huge effect of the jihad. Try to put together a wee timeline of events a few years ahead. You can distribute those as newsreels to your players.
Not all of those things would be directly relevant or even touch on your nation, but the IS shouldn't revolve around your nation neither. Make it clear important stuff is happening elsewhere. It inspires.
Hope this is helpful, or at least amusing to you.
Paul
[ This Message was edited by: Paul on 2003-12-12 10:38 ]
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Storm
Draconis Combine
Chu-i
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 278
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Dec-2003 14:34 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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Hmmmmm . . . .
With MWDA taking over, and The Republic of the Sphere conquering Al Na'ir, I am considering moving the Marauders to a Periphery world. Noever comsidered running my own empire.
As far as actions go, I would work on advancing my tech as far as possible, beyond the IS/Clans in any area, if I could, especially communications (HPG), K-F drives and ship construction, and of course, bigger gunz, and new 'mech designs, engines, control systems, yeah . . . lots of possibilities there.
Externally, I'd maintain a strong defense along any border I shared with a House, and anyone sucking up to a house.
I would abandon man's fascination with Terra as the center of the universe and expand deep into the periphery. Build an empire away from all the Houses, Clans, Republics, and blah blah blah.
In a generation or three, when you have established a stronger empire, you could begin to trade with the IS on better terms.
Storm
_________________
Storm  "The More that thou sweatest and swearest in training, the less thou bleedest and diest in combat."--Dick Marcinko
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Storm
Draconis Combine
Chu-i
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 278
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Dec-2003 14:42 Post subject: Periphery or Bust |
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With the Republic of the Sphere conquering my homeworld of Al Na'ir (which I chose precisely because no one ever mucked with it), I am moving the Marauders outward. I refuse to have my unit cow down to some dipstick's disarmament policies, and I'm sure the Houses will still be wailing the crap out of themselves and the clans.
Soooooooo:
WANTED:
Reinforced Batalion with partial transportation support seeks long-term contract, and new home for Anubis Industries/Horus Aerospace, our original employer and weapons designer.
Contract must provide safe home world for dependents, transporation costs when necessary, at least 50-50% salvage rights, and someone's butt to kick.
Wobblies, RotSpheroids, Steiners, Liaos, anyone related with Caesar O'Reilley, and Clanners need not apply.
_________________
Storm "The More that thou sweatest and swearest in training, the less thou bleedest and diest in combat."--Dick Marcinko
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Dec-2003 15:10 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. [LONG] |
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On 2003-12-12 10:36, Paul wrote:
Edit: Good LORD! That post ended up huge! My apologies to everyone using flat mode...
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apology accepted
I think you're misunderstanding some fluff. The numbers in Combat Operations (I'll post those when I get back home) for instance indicate the number of *inhabited* planets in each realm.
Which does include a whole boatload of semi-worthless agricultural planets. Your ratio there seems fine, even the number of factories you have, it's just that you've given yourself 325 worlds, which is roughly equivalent to the FWL, IIRC. There are currently 2200ish known inhabited planets in BT, including Clan Space.
The TC and MoC really do have around 20 worlds, as does the OA. Unmarked populated worlds exist only if they're undiscovered, which'd disqualify them as a component of any known realm.
okay so I guess I shrink the planets to about 110 worlds. Drop the RCTs to something like 25. I would have 5 elite (these do hire out) 1 RCT that is elite Cadre for the academies (combined arms battalions). 5 Vetran, 10 regular and 4 green. 1 each of veteran, regular, and green would have "apron strings" attached by Davion. The rest would be broken into battalions (55 Cbt Cmnds) that would give me decent garrisons for half the worlds. The 3 remaining green rcts would be my mobile teams, doing the equivalent of Sun Zhang, and NAIS cadre "learning from Darwin" type training.
Quantity of planets.
Rewrite it to:
The vast majority were agricutural oriented and are mainly looking for some one to call when pirates hit with mechs. This proved too spread out and indefensible. Many folks were relocated to more self reliant planets and given the same homes, on the new world, that they left behind. This shrunk the total area to be defended by half or more, while getting decent population densities to begin gaining self sufficiency/ industrial capacity. Additional colonists were recruited with promises os a "homestead" land hold that was theirs when they "proved up" in 5 years. Landhold benefits were also provided as a "bounty" for veteran warriors retiring from the merc and local regiments.
think you're using the term RCT too loosely then. Also, not making it a permanent structure is a waste of time, training and red tape. [snip]
I already covered the answer to this earlier.
Make it self financing? Good lord, most of your worlds can't afford that.
So the drag isn't the actual cost of the system (which could be considerable, given the rules of supply and demand), it's more the effect the super slow communications will have on your realm.
If anything, this almost completely balances your realm with the current BT fluff. You're big, but can't be expected to be a threat of consequence.
okay with the shrinkage I should be able to set up a "busline " set of express routes that would carry dropboats and mail. With fees it should be efficient enough. Slow yes, but it would definately improve on the other method. There would be room for Tramp Traders in both jump and drop ships, but a form of regular communication would exist. Maybe that would get me to the Civil War era level of communication with a Train equivalent in the regular routes.
[snip] we obviously aggree on the "camelot" thing. The most that might be found is a temporary firebase from unification war, or a misjumped ship.
Yes you do. 13 Mech regiments plus support elements, well, if you just bring your elite and vet Mech RCTs, all 13-14 of em, you'd crush all the pirates
How many Mechs etc do you see those pirates as having anyway? Most pirates listed in FM:U are kinda tiny.
okay I do. I could hire my own troops and probably crush them thoroughly. I stil do not want to garrison them. do a "bug bomb" every few years. Then again Tortuga is a nice little compact group....... something to run by the younger fire eaters. Don't forget the Vinnies Vicious Virgins type mercs running around and the Smoked Kitty refugees running around.
The DCMS doesn't use RCTs, plus would have to deal with your huge and highly skilled military. With their Clan and FS front, they can't afford extended operations. Limited operations could nab some worlds, and keep them. More so if you plan to loose a world or 2 from a DCMS counterstrike as to allow them to save face.
okay, enough about the mostly elite military, the fluff would obviously have to be adjusted. I did so. so I would have to take 5 planets and let the DC take back 2? and still be facing dirty tricks from the ISF that is ruthless and unrestricted by dogma, like ROM?
Nope, I would rather gain the planets from totuga, or the OA.
Why would WoB care? They're more likely to put on their kneepads and start apologizing, trying to subvert your nice lil realm.
About a month after the subversion WOB would try and sugar coat their dogma. Exactly a new york minute later there would be a horrendous blood bath as blood maddened mobs tried to eradicate every scrap (including those required by necessity) of C* (like that shortcut) taint from the realm. These people are passionate about this, C* is barely tolerated, mainly because there is no way to live without a few HPGs too link with the I.S. Just about EVERY family lost some one to C* during the Harrowing.
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As it is I am in the same boat a Phelan Kell, a massive chicken bone. As it is the pirates give me something to blood new units on every 5-10 years.
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That's a T-Rex sized chicken.
I like V-Raptor better, did I succeed?
This is a problem for any intel organization. You'll have to deal with it. True, you have a good point, recruiting in the IS does open you up for infiltration.
Always have multiple layers. If you pick up the same vibe from 10 different contacts, many of which in different elements of the enemy nation (military, government, civilian, mercenary, criminal, etc) something's going on.
I would be more subtle, change wording from a certain paragraph in the document keyed to who it goes to. I would know which guy had a leak in his group, but not the xact person, but you get the idea.
wheels with in wheels and interconnected bubbles are a standard thing. I just have a scouting group that does good CI with a decent network. It worked well for a merc group, but not for a, face it, government. I am going to have fun with growing pains.
If you maintain your current size, you'll be pretty high profile. Expect a LOT of attention.
Hello Angels! We're picking up data that the Suns might be sending the Crucis Lancers this way. Yes, all of em. Go there and see what's going on.
Yes Charlie!
I wish I had a set of those angels. I do want size, but I also want to balance it too. Small enough not to really threaten a house, but big enough to make a Prefecture or March to think hard before leaping. I guess I live with some attention, and take care of the necessary details in rewrites.
Final point: just recruiting a Tech doesn't mean you've got a man who can build you a factory including all the machinery you need to make the parts you need.
It means you got a man who knows how to fix a tractor/tank/mech/whatever.
I was talking a master tech, who has had several courses in business. I corrected the social general issue with the rewrite. Billy-Joe and Jim-Bob would sum up the agricultural/backwater nature of a lot of planets. with the chop to about 1/3 and the presence of the combat command, you would noe have Infantry with some antimech training. I guess I'll just have to cringe at the Platoon or two to kill a mech price of the regular rules. I was hoping a platoon with the equivalent of gauss rifles would be able to do something. maybe I should develop a send off party concept for those going military. All the unattached females get together in a massive rave with the male warriors........ it would solve population issues, neh? (it also open another can of worms, i'll skip it)
The SDI stuff is a nuke on a plate. The plate slow the explosion down a bit and causes slightly more force to be directed in the opposite direction. Basically a shaped charge atomic.
okay, that will work. The fluff is mainly to do the necessary "dressup"
Very large force. You may have denser ASF protection than the CC and FWL. (poorly documented except for the forces attached to ground units) Do you attach any ASFs to your RCTs?
Yes, at about the same ratio as in canon. The primary mission is to keep aerospace off the mechs backs. The density only applies at the space yard, and war factory planets.
[Snip]
Agreement on Education.
Surrender (partial) about #worlds.
Discussion about population and infrastructure.(discussed further below)
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Luck, some seriously hot die rolls during a contact dispute, during recruiting, and some shrewd use of fluff. The mercs are still working for cash and funneling most of the profit and salvage into development.
Lots of the planets are in a barter set up. We'll send you x food/ore, you defend us. type of situation. They are counted since there is a contract there. but you do that thru a lot of planets, you get the $$$ to afford the military units. Like I said before a lot of the RCTs lack a mech unit, but they do make pirate raids very dangerous.
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Its not your number of factories that's amazing. Well, not just that. It's the infrastructure popping up out of nowhere. The various Houses had an infrastructure before the 1st War. Lots of it got nuked, lots dried up, lots remained. They just revitalized it. (Dont ask me how)
You have to start in the stone age and build up. With the base resources of a wealthy and successful Merc company, not an engineering concern with contracts on a few hundred worlds in the IS.
not quite nothing, there were a few planets that dissappeared of the I.S. navigation charts, discovered by Comstar, and kept isolated. They are decently populated and a couple of them serve as key planets. I have fluf for a couple resulting from "accidental colonies" with misjumps and such from initial and later human activity. I haven't decided to use them yet, they can go to the dust collection file easily. Ther is a feel of a certain amount of border "shrinkage" that seems to be in the books, like the loss of technology. The core/key planets have a decent population, but were kept in a static state by pirate raids, C* benign neglect, and other factors. We gamed it out, and there was no major "hot rolling" either.
But just because you salvage a Lancelot doesn't mean you can start producing them.
true it took about a year of careful reasearch, and another of redevelopment to get the tools for the tools to build it.
Hell yeah! Thats a nice March that's developing there.
yep, depends on "Da' Plan" but it is a possiblity. The current line of Marquis has some leverage with the royals due to his credibility with the periphery folks and his sucess in developing things. Both because he was a hometown boy and due to hisdeal decisively with his competitors. In 3005 about 10 new Marquis were appointed to develop the periphery and skid row areas. The founder was able to convince the Davions he was a good candidate.
That effort (to move units) would put stress between you and the FS and gives you a reason for some strife, even skirmishes and a war of independence.
A line of plot that I had in mind. maybe Davion would accept the Militias into house service, while the Mercs and some vetran units would become like the Rangers or Fusiliers. The loyalties of the militias would remain with the periphery tho' at least for awhile.
But that's what it's all about. Your military, while not as huge as I initially thought, will make a HUGE difference in that conflict.
which is why they were able to say "leave us out of this" and make it stick. Trying to make them join you would push them (horrors) into the other camp.
[i]
well you are doing fine expressing yourself. there are a lot of guys on this board that scream MUNCHIENESS! and hide in a corner. Then cannot say WHY they think it is munchy.
Thank you for your self control. I think the shrinkage will make a lot of stuff manageable.
I still am going to retain the Facilities that were developed. they were roleplayed out and developed with great difficulty. (The first succession was caused by the original "duke" dying in defense of one of them.) The second duke was an old age casualty, being the only viable fill in until the current duke came of age. things have been very jury rigged from the government stand point. One of the mech facilities has been built from machinery stolen during the 4th sucession war! That cost the better part of a RCT. I am going to extract a serious price for the Warship building capability too. Maybe I can leverage them into a March? either that or a War of Independance? We'll see.
Any other WILD ideas?
_________________
Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side & a dark side, and strings also lie under it all.
Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Dec-2003 15:45 Post subject: RE: Periphery or Bust |
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Anubis industries is a mech builder? I could offer you land holds in two locations.
The first would be in Rolinstone. It is a belt system, much like Al'nair. I could offer you a 1 dergee chunk of belt for your stomping grounds. I am sure you could find a sizable asteroid, and either hollow it out or use it as raw material to build one of the space habitat designs we have developed.
The second would be a Mountain Valley very much like the one found in the Myoo Mountains of Hesperus.
Both sites would be undeveloped, but you could situate with neighbors in mind.
Basic questions I have:
Are you now or ever been a member of Comstar?
Have you ever worked for Comstar?
Who are your last 3 contractors?
Move your reply to a Periphery or bust string and we can discuss this further.
_________________
Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side & a dark side, and strings also lie under it all.
Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 12-Dec-2003 15:46 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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okay, so far. Paul please verify.
There is agreement about the following:
No Camelot command stuff.
Things were too big.
Education set up will work.
Comstar stuff explained.
Redneck platoons are out.
Location is clear and okay.
Under discussion:
How much to reduce size.
Infrastructure (factories)
Population.
Government.
one shot naval PPC.
pony express network.
_________________
Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side & a dark side, and strings also lie under it all.
Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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-Mud
ex-Jade Falcon
Bounty Hunter
Joined: 04-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 1082
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| Posted: 13-Dec-2003 20:04 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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| A Periphery realm with Jumpship manufacturing capacity?! Number one priority: don't let the nearest successor state know, or else they'll be on you like white on rice. Forget battlemech facilities; any house would jump at the chance to seize such a lightly defended jumpship yard. Seriously though, your parameters sound a bit overblown in certain respects. I think the entire Inner Sphere only produces only an average of 1-2 jumpships a year in 3025....why do you think they're sancrosanct in warfare?
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Rarich
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 991
Location: United States
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| Posted: 14-Dec-2003 12:27 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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Mud- I have never read your posts, and this is my first and last reply- stay away from me.
Have a nife life.
_________________
Duct tape is like the force. It has a light side & a dark side, and strings also lie under it all.
Life is a sexually transmitted terminal disease.
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-Mud
ex-Jade Falcon
Bounty Hunter
Joined: 04-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 1082
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| Posted: 14-Dec-2003 12:30 Post subject: RE: Decision making for a periphery realm. |
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hehehe...wow, you really are amusing
p.s. get a life
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