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Havoc~Ronin
Federated Suns
Major
Joined: 13-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 427
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 Posted: 13-Feb-2004 15:19 Post subject: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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It has been awhile since I have posted a mech preference request. So, here it is.......
Given that the Centurion has a reputation of being a solid good medium mech and that the Shadowhawk is a popular, if not ever-present mech, I thought it would be interesting to see people' preferences. I will keep it to specific models, so here are the choices:
1.) Centurion CN9-A, or
2.) Shadowhawk SHD-2M
As always, I will give two terrain choices to see if that will change your pick. First arena is an open style terrain with few hills and some wooded areas. The second one is a city location.
Let it begin..........
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"Ours is not to question why, ours is just to do...."
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Oafman
Draconis Combine
Tai-sho
Joined: 18-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 1657
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Feb-2004 15:33 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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I could not find the stats of the specific Shadow hawk and have not used the Centurion. But making a basic comparison fo the two I would take the Cent on the open field because of the LRM15 but the Shadow Hawk in the city because of the jump capabilities.
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Festina Lente!
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-Mud
ex-Jade Falcon
Bounty Hunter
Joined: 04-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 1082
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| Posted: 13-Feb-2004 15:42 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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On 2004-02-13 15:19, Havoc~Ronin wrote:
1.) Centurion CN9-A, or
2.) Shadowhawk SHD-2M
As always, I will give two terrain choices to see if that will change your pick. First arena is an open style terrain with few hills and some wooded areas. The second one is a city location.
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The Hawk's superior mobility will be a good asset; it also has enough jump jets to carry it over enough buildings to block line of sight. Armor differential between the two does not appear to be too much of a factor. The Centurion has a slight advantage in weapons. The LRM-10, AC/10 combo in particular should do a lot of damage. The Hawk's SRM-2 and LRM-5 are more harrassment weapons than anything. The AC/5 (or AC/7) and medium laser do not compliment one another particularly well in this match. The Hawk could win by combining quick, long-range sniping from heavy cover with some well-placed physical attacks. The Centurion is a more conservative design, and should be used as such. A defensive strategy might force the Shadow Hawk to depend on its speed more than advantageous terrain, giving the Centurion a few openings. I do not think terrain is a huge factor here. The Shadow Hawk's jump jets become more effective in the city, but its ground speed becomes less so. Overall, I will give the Centurion marginally better odds. I think you picked a close one.
****
A quick edit...are you sure you did not mean the SHD-2H; the 2M is a newtech design?
[ This Message was edited by: -Mud on 2004-02-13 15:46 ]
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Havoc~Ronin
Federated Suns
Major
Joined: 13-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 427
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| Posted: 13-Feb-2004 16:20 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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Sorry, I can't read my own writing..... The Shadowhawk I am referring to is the 2H model as correctly pointed out by Mud.
My bad.
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"Ours is not to question why, ours is just to do...."
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Sir Henry
Team Bansai
Senior Tech Specialist
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 4899
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Feb-2004 16:35 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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I care for mobility over firepower in most cases. I like the Shadowhawk.
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Sir Henry
A Dragon in the disguise of a bunny, is still a Dragon.
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Stinger
The Knights of Chaos
General
Joined: 30-Apr-2002 00:00
Posts: 1833
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Feb-2004 18:18 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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Same I prefer the shadowhawk.
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Stinger
If it's "creepy" to use the Internet, military satellites, and robot aircraft to find a house full of gorgeous young models so I can drop in on them unexpected, then FINE, I'm "creepy". Howard Wolowitz. BBT.
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AWAD
Draconis Combine
Chu-sa
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 766
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| Posted: 13-Feb-2004 19:07 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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Centurion wins hands down. Come on a jump of 3? a 5/8 versus 4/6, an AC/10 and ML vs a ML and SRM2 at very short range? Yeah the Shawk can dance a little but it is a plinker. The Armor on both are good but the Centurion has 10 pt clusters. That will leave a mark. Plus it is in the arm, so even is the Shawk gets some manuver in..... the 10 can reach many places.
AWAD- Centurion is a like the Roman Legionare, steady, tough, and ruthless in numbers
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Pinhead
The Bloody Clans
Joined: 25-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1258
Location: United States
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| Posted: 13-Feb-2004 20:06 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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I don't think the Shadowhawk can get out of its own way.. I'd take ghe centurion without a question.
Pin
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Nightmare
Lyran Alliance
Kommandant-General
Joined: 03-May-2002 00:00
Posts: 2214
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| Posted: 14-Feb-2004 16:22 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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I've always done good work with Centurions. It's certainly a better mech than the Shadow Hawk in the field. Even in the city the SHD will be hard pressed to do anything solid.
The SHD just isn't made for combat. IMO it's a training mech. Learn to use ACs, lasers, SRMs and LRMs in a jumping mech, woohoo! If you want a main combat mech you pick a Centurion, if you want a jumping scout you pick a Phoenix Hawk or perhaps a Wolverine.
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Old Dog
Capellan Confederation
Sang-wei
Joined: 24-May-2002 00:00
Posts: 299
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| Posted: 15-Feb-2004 09:59 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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Believe it or not, I'll go with the Shadowhawk, but it won't be pretty.
The Hawk is gonna take some hits while moving in, since the long range options it has are, as noted 'Plinks' more than real hits.
Once it's closed, however, the Hawk picks up an advantage in that the Centurian can't use the LRM and is too slow to seperate once engaged. The medium laser and SRM-2 aren't much, I'll admit, but are better than nothing and don't build up heat. The Hawk has to try and stay at just the right range, denying the LRM fire but allowing his own AC/5 fire (Probably with a small penalty) ... 3 hexes sounds ideal, giving her short range for the SRM and M Laser, while the AC/5 penalty isn't that bad. With so many damage rolls, the bell curve puts the torso of the Centurian getting dinked up pretty harsh, which take out one weapon system or the other after about five, maybe six vollies. The 10-pt chunks are effective, but since there are less damage rolls, they'll splatter a bit more. If an AC/5, two M-Lasers, and trhe SRM-2's hit the Centurian's legs, for example, no great loss, but if the AC/10 loses a pair of hits, one to each Hawk leg, it's hurting and *fast*.
If the Centurian loses a torso/weapon, the Hawk can then choose what range to fight at, ending it prett convincingly. Using the maneuvering advantage, the Hawk should always try to shoot from teh right side, to collect damage there, to get rid of the AC ... a Centurian with only a LRM-15 is a sitting duck.
So, yes, I'm going to pick the Shadowhawk, but it'll have internal damage in a side torso, and probably have just taken teh first Center Torso intrnal as the Centurian falls.
-- Old Dog, Shadow Snauzer
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Slythis
Federated Suns
Colonel
Joined: 09-Aug-2002 00:00
Posts: 712
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| Posted: 16-Feb-2004 13:53 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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Having played this scenario a grand total of 20 times with REAL people the score is as follows:
Centurian: 20
Shadowhawk: 0
sorry, Shawk just isn't fast enough to make a differance and has some real trouble trying to move and shoot at the same time, in almost every round the AC/5 hit atmost 3 times before it's ammo was exhasted anyone with even the faintest clue as to what they are doing with the CNT will kick the Shawk around fairly easily.
oh and Old Dog, it's a LRM-10 with 2 Medium Lasers, NOT and LRM-15 and nothing else.
[ This Message was edited by: Slythis on 2004-02-16 13:57 ]
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Kiris65
Draconis Combine
Tai-i
Joined: 17-Dec-2003 00:00
Posts: 371
Location: Panama
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| Posted: 16-Feb-2004 14:06 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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The Hawk has to try and stay at just the right range |
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If an AC/5, two M-Lasers, and trhe SRM-2's hit the Centurian's legs |
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if the AC/10 loses a pair of hits, one to each Hawk leg, it's hurting and *fast*. |
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If the Centurian loses a torso/weapon, the Hawk can then choose what range to fight at, ending it prett convincingly. |
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the Hawk should always try to shoot from teh right side, to collect damage there, to get rid of the AC ...
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to may Ifs and trys and shoulds for my taste..
leaving too much on lady luck.
If I was riding the 'hawk, I'ld would flank the Centurion's left and keep that A/C10 from getting a good firing solution, instead of hoping I get that gun out of action, I like to gamble sometimes, but the A/C 10 is not a weapon to be fooling around with, that thing can hurt people. Flanking his left would also give me the chance to put myself in position to chip away the Centurion's left or rear sides.
[ This Message was edited by: Kiris65 on 2004-02-16 14:13 ]
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ralgith
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company
"Ralgith's Renegades"
Colonel
Joined: 18-Aug-2003 00:00
Posts: 2021
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Feb-2004 16:22 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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Unless I'm misunderstanding, he wasn't asking who would win in a fight between the two mechs, just which you prefer. However, I agree with most of the posts, then centurion would win 99/100 in a stand up fight. However, it's too bad this is into specific models, cause my custom shadow hawk would rip both of the standard mechs up one side and down the other.
Ciao
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Colonel Ralgith t'Mayasara
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company 'Ralgith's Renegades'
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Pinhead
The Bloody Clans
Joined: 25-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1258
Location: United States
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| Posted: 16-Feb-2004 19:46 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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Quote:
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On 2004-02-16 16:22, ralgith wrote:
Unless I'm misunderstanding, he wasn't asking who would win in a fight between the two mechs, just which you prefer. However, I agree with most of the posts, then centurion would win 99/100 in a stand up fight. However, it's too bad this is into specific models, cause my custom shadow hawk would rip both of the standard mechs up one side and down the other.
Ciao
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I can make a custom configuration of almost any mech that would rip the standard ones to pieces... (shrug)
It is easy to fight with a mech that exactly mirrors what you like to fight with.. It takes skill to fight with a mech that is not an overwhelming favorite.
Pin
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-Mud
ex-Jade Falcon
Bounty Hunter
Joined: 04-Nov-2003 00:00
Posts: 1082
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| Posted: 16-Feb-2004 23:06 Post subject: RE: Centurion vs Shadowhawk |
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| As the general favorite seems to be the Centurion (although I think a lot of people are writing the Hawk off a bit quickly) what if a Griffin replaced the Shadow Hawk?
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