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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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 Posted: 09-Jun-2002 11:47 Post subject: Technology question |
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If the IS has the technology available to make an mg track and intercept incoming high velocity missiles, shouldn't they also have the technology to make said machine guns (or similar size weapons) track and intercept just about any target within their range?
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Gangrene
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Ares
Clan Jade Falcon
Star Colonel
Joined: 20-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 737
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 12:03 Post subject: Technology question |
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in theory, yes, but what are you getting at? AMS systems converted to attack aircraft or vechicles wouldn't be that effective, and against 'mechs it almost wouldn't do anything at all. Besides, you'd have to get into range. Now, if they made an UAC2 AMS, then sign me up 
EDIT:
don't the clans have AMS systems also? (I'm assuming this is what your referring to)
[ This Message was edited by: Ares on 2002-06-09 12:04 ]
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8072
Location: United States
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 12:21 Post subject: Technology question |
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(moved from design submissions to general discussion)
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 12:52 Post subject: Technology question |
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On 2002-06-09 12:03, Ares wrote:
in theory, yes, but what are you getting at? AMS systems converted to attack aircraft or vechicles wouldn't be that effective, and against 'mechs it almost wouldn't do anything at all.
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Wouldn't be that effective, huh? I don't think you've played the game enough if you believe that. While it wouldn't be devastating or overwhelming, those high accuracy pin pricks could be death to your harasser units. Especially if the range of weapons was bumped up to include medium lasers and med pulse lasers.
And I already wrote rules for a system that targeted infantry, which would greatly enhance a mechs effectiveness in urban combat.
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don't the clans have AMS systems also? (I'm assuming this is what your referring to)
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Yeah, but the clans aren't known for their ingenuity. And quite frankly they're boring to discuss.
Sorry chihawk, I thought the design board might be better place for it.
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[ This Message was edited by: Gangrene on 2002-06-09 15:17 ]
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Talen
Capellan Confederation
Sang-shao
Joined: 05-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 1269
Location: United States
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 12:58 Post subject: Technology question |
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Good ol Chihawk...always the persistent "I'll put it where I think it belongs" guy.
You can look at it 2 ways...
1)The tracking system locks on to the intense heat of the missle fuel. Now, I am not sure how this works...but I think that the missle fuel burns hot....VERY hot...and I think it burns hotter than any thing else out there. This would allow the system to target a huge incoming mass of heat (works better against larger groups of missiles) and throws up a wall of bullets. I doubt it tracks actual missles. The case in point is the currently used Phalanx CIWS used on American Warships. The system tracks the missle and then throws up a wall of bullets. Should there be a swarm of missles, there is, in theory, enough bullets to take care of most of them. But, if I remember right...the Phalanx tracking system isnt entirely independent, and is tied into to the multi-billion dollar system the ships have. So, back to Battletech. The AMS system prolly doesnt track individual missles and takes them down one at a time. It would be more inneficient than it already is, and due to the closing speeds...1 or 2 of 20 would be shot down.
If such is the case, then a system that locks on to Aircraft or Elementals would not be so likely.
2) The system DOES lock on to indivudual targets as small as missles...then those ideas are quite feasible. But an auto-AA gun throwing up such precise shots is not a likey idea to me. It would require advanced systems that the IS that I have known for 7 years cant field. The Clans might, but doubtful.
Ok...eat it...
Oh, and GG...WHEN ARE WE GONNA FIGHT!!!
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[ This Message was edited by: Talen on 2002-06-09 12:59 ]
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 15:12 Post subject: Technology question |
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The case in point is the currently used Phalanx CIWS used on American Warships. The system tracks the missle and then throws up a wall of bullets. Should there be a swarm of missles, there is, in theory, enough bullets to take care of most of them. But, if I remember right...the Phalanx tracking system isnt entirely independent, and is tied into to the multi-billion dollar system the ships have.
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The CIWS is the model I am working off of. It is entirely independent of other shipboard systems. Furthermore, the CIWS uses radar to track individual missiles and its own bullets, allowing for closed-loop correction. This is probably the only way a direct fire ballistic AMS would be able to work. Given missiles speed and small size, simply throwing up a bunch of bullets would probably be ineffective.
As for using themal imaging, the Forward Looking InfraRed system the Phalanx uses is for slow, low flying aircraft and surface vessels; not missiles.
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2) The system DOES lock on to indivudual targets as small as missles...then those ideas are quite feasible. But an auto-AA gun throwing up such precise shots is not a likey idea to me. It would require advanced systems that the IS that I have known for 7 years cant field. The Clans might, but doubtful.
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But . . . that's how the CIWS works. Man, this future technology sucks.
Oh, and GG...WHEN ARE WE GONNA FIGHT!!!
Check your email.
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Gangrene
[ This Message was edited by: Gangrene on 2002-06-09 15:13 ]
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AWAD
Draconis Combine
Chu-sa
Joined: 06-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 766
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 18:34 Post subject: Technology question |
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On 2002-06-09 15:12, Gangrene wrote:
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The case in point is the currently used Phalanx CIWS used on American Warships. The system tracks the missle and then throws up a wall of bullets. Should there be a swarm of missles, there is, in theory, enough bullets to take care of most of them. But, if I remember right...the Phalanx tracking system isnt entirely independent, and is tied into to the multi-billion dollar system the ships have.
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The CIWS is the model I am working off of. It is entirely independent of other shipboard systems. Furthermore, the CIWS uses radar to track individual missiles and its own bullets, allowing for closed-loop correction. This is probably the only way a direct fire ballistic AMS would be able to work. Given missiles speed and small size, simply throwing up a bunch of bullets would probably be ineffective.
As for using themal imaging, the Forward Looking InfraRed system the Phalanx uses is for slow, low flying aircraft and surface vessels; not missiles.
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2) The system DOES lock on to indivudual targets as small as missles...then those ideas are quite feasible. But an auto-AA gun throwing up such precise shots is not a likey idea to me. It would require advanced systems that the IS that I have known for 7 years cant field. The Clans might, but doubtful.
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But . . . that's how the CIWS works. Man, this future technology sucks.
Oh, and GG...WHEN ARE WE GONNA FIGHT!!!
Check your email.
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Gangrene
[ This Message was edited by: Gangrene on 2002-06-09 15:13 ]
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You are both right and wrong. The Phalanx using that billion dollar system to identify and track it as it comes in. This gives the basic telemratry. AS it gets really close, firing range, the FC of the Phalanx takes over and whips out bullets. I took this class ages ago but that I belive in the jist of it. A little trick is the big tacking system can be from a different ship, like an Ageis. This is done in case a bunch of missiles are coming it. Other ships may try and intercept the missiles, albiet not good chances, so the one does not get overwhelemed. Also this is done to make sure that they track the ones that may affect it instead of another shops and then get whacked when the real danger approaches.
Another fun thing, little ships like frigates, have a thing called a blip enhancer. Makes their ship look bigger than a carrier. I bet the CO love that command. This is Admiral Stud, Cmdr Smuck, please turn on the blip enhancer.
Back to Btech. I allow AMS to fire upon troops that are jumping to swarm a mech. That is a rude surpirse. I allow it to affect even elementals. Makes AMS worth a tiny bit more.
AWAD- AMS ought to have more ammo for same weight
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Gangrene
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 939
Location: United States
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 18:48 Post subject: Technology question |
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On 2002-06-09 18:34, AWAD wrote:
You are both right and wrong. The Phalanx using that billion dollar system to identify and track it as it comes in. This gives the basic telemratry. AS it gets really close, firing range, the FC of the Phalanx takes over and whips out bullets. I took this class ages ago but that I belive in the jist of it. A little trick is the big tacking system can be from a different ship, like an Ageis. This is done in case a bunch of missiles are coming it. Other ships may try and intercept the missiles, albiet not good chances, so the one does not get overwhelemed. Also this is done to make sure that they track the ones that may affect it instead of another shops and then get whacked when the real danger approaches.
Another fun thing, little ships like frigates, have a thing called a blip enhancer. Makes their ship look bigger than a carrier. I bet the CO love that command. This is Admiral Stud, Cmdr Smuck, please turn on the blip enhancer.
Back to Btech. I allow AMS to fire upon troops that are jumping to swarm a mech. That is a rude surpirse. I allow it to affect even elementals. Makes AMS worth a tiny bit more.
AWAD- AMS ought to have more ammo for same weight
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My info is off the FAS website. But that's skirting the issue.
How come a similar system cannot be devised to track more important targets? If a wasp or BA jump to my rear how come I cannot have a system that automatically prioritizes the enemy and engages it? A rear firing small pulse or mg that can track and engage a relatively large, slow target like a light mech without need for the pilot's supervision would be helpful.
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chihawk
Clan Blood Spirit
Master Bartender
Joined: 04-Feb-2002 00:00
Posts: 8072
Location: United States
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| Posted: 09-Jun-2002 19:39 Post subject: Technology question |
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On 2002-06-09 12:58, Talen wrote:
Good ol Chihawk...always the persistent "I'll put it where I think it belongs" guy.
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I was told that anything without a design belongs in "general discussion", so that's where it went. 
And to be honest a lot of people don't look in the design submissions forum, so there'd be more views on this forun and more likely more responses.
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comstarone
ComStar
Recruit
Joined: 16-Feb-2005 00:00
Posts: 4
Location: United States
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| Posted: 19-Feb-2005 18:17 Post subject: RE: Technology question |
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Whats with the clan ranks,clans destroyed the real battletech game.  i developed klingon plazma weapontry.range,1 map is short,2maps is medium,3 maps is long.20 tons.12 criticals.400 damage.-2 all ranges to hit,-5 to hit all clans.What do you think?
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Motown Scrapper
Clan Ice Hellions
Galaxy Commander
Joined: 24-Jul-2003 00:00
Posts: 2074
Location: United States
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| Posted: 19-Feb-2005 18:58 Post subject: RE: Technology question |
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On 2005-02-19 18:17, comstarone wrote:
Whats with the clan ranks,clans destroyed the real battletech game. i developed klingon plazma weapontry.range,1 map is short,2maps is medium,3 maps is long.20 tons.12 criticals.400 damage.-2 all ranges to hit,-5 to hit all clans.What do you think?
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You are wrong surat...We SAVED it.
Sheesh spheroids all they do is whine!
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Warhammer: 3025
Freelance
Captain, AFFC (Ret.)
Joined: 29-Jan-2005 00:00
Posts: 1856
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| Posted: 19-Feb-2005 19:02 Post subject: RE: Technology question |
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What does that have to do with anything? 
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ralgith
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company
"Ralgith's Renegades"
Colonel
Joined: 18-Aug-2003 00:00
Posts: 2021
Location: United States
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| Posted: 19-Feb-2005 20:14 Post subject: RE: Technology question |
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On 2005-02-19 19:02, Warhammer: 3025 wrote:
What does that have to do with anything?
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That was precisely what I wondered when I read it, then I realized he has no clue what the heck hes talking about. 
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Colonel Ralgith t'Mayasara
Blighted Sun Battalion
1st Company 'Ralgith's Renegades'
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Motown Scrapper
Clan Ice Hellions
Galaxy Commander
Joined: 24-Jul-2003 00:00
Posts: 2074
Location: United States
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| Posted: 19-Feb-2005 20:23 Post subject: RE: Technology question |
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On 2005-02-19 20:14, ralgith wrote:
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On 2005-02-19 19:02, Warhammer: 3025 wrote:
What does that have to do with anything?
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That was precisely what I wondered when I read it, then I realized he has no clue what the heck hes talking about.
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Aff I was puzzled as to where that came from myself....I tell you we have been getting some real dinks lately
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StarRaven
Federated Suns
Leftenant General
Joined: 01-Jun-2004 00:00
Posts: 1138
Location: United States
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| Posted: 19-Feb-2005 21:08 Post subject: RE: Technology question |
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On 2005-02-19 18:17, comstarone wrote:
Whats with the clan ranks,clans destroyed the real battletech game. i developed klingon plazma weapontry.range,1 map is short,2maps is medium,3 maps is long.20 tons.12 criticals.400 damage.-2 all ranges to hit,-5 to hit all clans.What do you think?
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I can't help but go one step futher.
What the hell are you talking about? And why did you post it in a three year old thread? It's not even on-topic. At least, I don't think it is. I haven't yet been able to figure out what you said.
[ This Message was edited by: StarRaven on 2005-02-19 21:08 ]
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